KIERAN GILBERT, HOST: Prime Minister, thanks for your time.
ANTHONY ALBANESE, PRIME MINISTER: Good to be with you, Kieran.
KIERAN GILBERT: It's been a big week. The big summit, the G2 as they call it, they landed a deal. How optimistic are you that that trade truce will hold for the good of those countries, but for the good of the world?
ANTHONY ALBANESE: I am optimistic. Because it is a breakthrough. President Trump and President Xi sitting down, engaging in dialogue. That's how you get understanding. So, we shouldn't be complacent about it or take things for granted, but we should acknowledge that it's an important step forward. And importantly, they have agreed that President Trump will visit China next year and President Xi will visit the United States.
KIERAN GILBERT: You say it's important, that dialogue. Why is that key to keeping the thing on its tracks?
PRIME MINISTER: Because out of dialogue comes understanding. Engagement, more formally, but also those informal discussions. It was a lengthy meeting between President Trump and President Xi. The fact that it was on the sidelines of APEC, that is an important economic leaders' forum for our region. And we know that trade disruption hurts the entire global economy. So, it's in everyone's interest for this to be progressed and we certainly wish for that to occur. And of course, Australia plays our role in supporting free and fair trade across the board. That's the message that I bring to APEC. It's the message I bring to the East Asia summit. It's the message that I bring to the bilateral meetings that I've had with people here in Korea and in Malaysia.
KIERAN GILBERT: And you've met with President Xi five times during this APEC Summit, so, plenty of occasions to exchange views with him. I know you're not going to share what you've discussed, but in broad terms, they're arguing here for free trade, for strong supply lines. There is a bit of irony, isn't there, given their recent threat to lock and impose export controls on rare earths, for example?
PRIME MINISTER: Well, it's a positive thing that China has brought that perspective to these discussions at APEC. They've advocated for supply chains to be open. They've advocated for there to be more engagement across the board and for there to be a benefit from everyone from trading regimes being understood, including through the World Trade Organisation. And one of the things we discussed today at APEC was of course artificial intelligence and what will happen with AI going forward. This is going to transform our economies. And when you have new technology, quite often what will happen is there's a disruption, but at the end of the processes, there's more jobs created as a result of that new technology and the lift in productivity that comes from it. But we need to make sure, of course, that human interactions are protected as well. Things like intellectual property as well is really important, as well as creative ownership as well, which is a concern including of course in your profession of journalism.
KIERAN GILBERT: Indeed. Has the US, though, opened a vacuum that China is filling in terms of this message, this leadership message that they're trying to articulate?
PRIME MINISTER: Well, what my job is, is to advocate for Australia's national interests. It's in Australia's national interests for there to be free and fair trade. One in four of our jobs depends upon trade. China's our major trading partner. We have, of course, removed overwhelmingly the impediments that were there between trade. That's a good thing. That's called benefits to Australia in terms of jobs in areas, everything from barley and agriculture through to of course seafood, wine, industry, as well as the traditional resources sector as well, that have benefited from that. But China's benefited as well because our products are good products, which is why they're in demand around the world.
KIERAN GILBERT: When we look at the whole week, you've had meetings with Xi, the lengthy meeting with Donald Trump, now in the space of 10 days, two lengthy meetings. You've got his mobile now, haven't you?
PRIME MINISTER: We are able to contact each other. We are. And that's a good thing that we're in contact with each other, but as I've said –
KIERAN GILBERT: Do you find it funny that people, and you've copped that criticism for weeks, but now that engagements are done, you can do what Macron, they pointed out, you can call him, or you can now. Do you feel a bit of vindication?
PRIME MINISTER: Look, I'm not a commentator. I'll leave that to others. I've said that the interactions I've had with President Trump, from our first phone call, have been very warm and positive. It was one of the first calls I got after the election on 3 May. And President Trump couldn't have been warmer, and we developed a relationship. That's a good thing. It's in the interests of the United States, but in the interests of Australia as well. We're pretty good partners, Kieran. We don't rely upon anyone else as if we come to arrangements not bringing anything to the table. We always put into every relationship, whether it be national security and intelligence issues or whether it be in economic issues or just the way that we relate in this region. We're important in the ASEAN region and in the Pacific in particular, as well as we're an Indian Ocean country as well. And so, Australia, I think, is a middle power. But we shouldn't talk ourselves down, which I think sometimes does occur.
KIERAN GILBERT: So people don't say I've put words in your mouth – so, you do, that's a yes. You do have his mobile now.
PRIME MINISTER: We have contact arrangements between each other.
KIERAN GILBERT: Great. Okay, so that's good. I can't be accused of interpreting that one way or the other. Now, any word on another visit by President Xi or possibly Donald Trump to Australia anytime soon?
PRIME MINISTER: We'll wait and see. Both of them of course would be welcome, as would other leaders. Premier Li will visit Australia next year, we've discussed that. And included in that was a discussion about a visit to Uluru that he expressed an interest in. I encourage that. I think that would be a very good thing to showcase Central Australia to what is after all well over a billion people. That's a pretty good tourism market for Australia as well.
KIERAN GILBERT: A couple of other ones to wrap up. Climate has been a big message. You said a number of leaders raised it. I know you don't get into domestic matters, but the Nationals are dropping it 9am Sunday morning, essentially. And they're going to link it to global emissions. Without commenting on the domestic stuff, is that possible? Can you do that?
PRIME MINISTER: I'll leave the circus that's gone on within the Coalition to them. What Australia knows is that it is in our national interest for there to be action to reduce our emissions and to act on climate change. Australia's particularly vulnerable. We act nationally. We've submitted our NDC, our nationally determined contribution as well, to the UN for 2035. It's an ambitious but achievable target and it's in our interest for that to occur. Just as it's in the interest of Australia to encourage global action. We're about to go into a summer period and we know that in the past that this can be a difficult time for Australians.
KIERAN GILBERT: Do you think – finally, I'll let you go, you're going to get on the plane – will we get the COP next year?
PRIME MINISTER: Well, we'll wait and see. The problem here is, Kieran, there's no real process for finalising the matter. I've written to President Erdogan of Türkiye, we're continuing to engage. There's – it's supposed to occur by consensus. It's hard when there's no consensus, when you've got two bids. Our bid, of course, is in partnership with the Pacific as well.
KIERAN GILBERT: You're still hopeful?
PRIME MINISTER: Indeed, and we are engaging with the Pacific. We want to make sure that their interests are protected in this as well, because they're particularly vulnerable to climate change. For them, countries like Tuvalu and Kiribati, this is an existential threat to their very existence, which is why this is such a strong issue in our region and why Australia will continue to act on climate change, because it is in our national interest.
KIERAN GILBERT: Prime Minister, thanks for your time.
PRIME MINISTER: Thanks very much, Kieran.